The Year of Moving Forward

The Year of Moving Forward
At our 4 person wedding reception in DC

Wednesday, April 22, 2009


There's too much to offer opinions on and too little time to do it.

It's Earth Day. We have a responsibility. You may get tired of me saying the same thing over and over, but that's what I do. Finally, you get it. Today Earth premieres. In Birmingham, it's playing at Rave Patton Creek and Carmike Summitt 16. Much of the footage has been seen in the Discovery Channel/BBC series "Planet Earth." Worth seeing again on the big screen.

The EPA is back on the job, according to Lisa Jackson, who heads the agency. Good.

Birmingham Councilwoman Miriam Witherspoon passed away yesterday morning. 48 is too young to die. My thoughts and prayers are with her family and friends.

Acting Freddie Mac chief David Kellermann is dead, suicide suspected.

Pandora's box has been opened. President Obama will not stand in the way of an inquiry into the use of torture. Some officials are saying the techniques worked. I say investigate!

Right wing extremist Representative Jay Love of Montgomery has introduced a resolution in the Alabama House that praises Carrie Prejean for speaking out against equal rights. How sad. And what a waste of time in a legislative body for which the clock is ticking.


Dan said...

Well, I am okay with what Jay Love is doing, but we don't need a resolution to know that Prejean did the right thing. I am thrilled to see someone as strong as Prejean willing to use a natioin stage to stand up for what is RIGHT. Too many of us just sit by and do nothing. Resolution or not, Prejean did and said the right thing.

Javi said...

Prejean did the right thing? I would say she merely stated her views on a particular subject. I suppose she was right in telling the truth about her views. However, I would not say her views are "right". They are just Prejean's opinion. For whatever that is worth.

I find it unnecessary and inflammatory to introduce a resolution praising someone's bigoted views on a subject.

And by the way, here's the definition of the word 'bigoted':
–adjective utterly intolerant of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.

randy said...

In the REAL WORLD Javi there is what we call ABSOLUTE TRUTH. Unfortunately we have swayed so far to the LEFT that we have forgotten what that means. Now days, everyone wants to be TOLERANT. In other words - you believe what you want to believe and I'll believe what I want to believe and we will be tolerant of each other. But some beliefs are WRONG. The belief that a man and a man or a woman and a woman should be married are WRONG. Marriage is plainly laid out in the holy scripture as the union of a man and a woman. There is no 'wiggle' room here. Prejean had the guts to say to a world wide audience what many would not have the balls to say. No need for a resolution. But that God for her witness.

lipscomb bohemian said...

by your [qualified?] judgement i surmise that you have successfully removed the beam from your eye.
we dont choose what we believe..we choose what we do but not what we believe...we might change our belief but it is by experience not by choosing.
the only thing wrong with christianity is [some] christians.
read the bible...front to back...[in my opinion you could skip anything paul had to say]

Javi said...

No, Randy, marriage is a civil institution. The only reason a priest, reverend, rabbi, etc. can marry anyone is because the state licenses them to do so. If the state said 'no', they couldn't do it. That's fact.

While it is legal for divorced people to remarry according to civil law, you don't see the Catholic church being forced to perform marriage ceremonies for divorced people, do you? In other words, you can handle marriage as a sacrament or union in your church as you wish, but your beliefs, which, real as they may seem to you, are not my beliefs, are best kept to those of you who agree with them, and kept out of the civil institution of marriage.

To claim that you, your church denomination, or your interpretation of scripture is the definitive, infallible and correct interpretation of what absolute truth is, is, well, laughable.

By all means, live by the tenets of your faith, but stop trying to enforce your beliefs on others. It really is as simple as that.

Joe said...

U. Javi,
Gays, myself included, are often accused of trying to force our beliefs on others over this issue. But in reality, we are not. I only offer that because you have correctly pointed out that people like Randy are trying to force their beliefs on us.

By allowing gays to marry, we are not forcing them to do anything. We are not forcing them to marry someone of the same sex.

I only bring this up because I know what is coming, and wanted to beat them to it.

Thanks for your continued support and your intelligent and thoughtful comments.

rev. bill said...

Suppose I BELIEVE that murder is wrong and you BELIEVE that it is okay. One of us is right and one of us is wrong. Same with theft. If you believe it is okay and I believe it is wrong, one of us is right and one of us is wrong. What about incest? Same thing. What about lying? If you BELIEVED it was okay and i BELIEVED that it was wrong, one of us would be right and one of us would be wrong.

It is that way with EVERYTHING. It is called absolute truth. The gay issue is no exception. One of us is right and one of us is wrong.

Again, same with Christianity and those who don't believe in God. Indeed, one is right and one is wrong.

It makes things difficult when one WANTS to believe in something that is indeed wrong. They will (as seen on this post and many others) try to 'justify' what they believe with statistics - usually from like minded individuals - to make what they believe sound 'right'. But the scripture is what it is. And you can twist it, turn it, spin it all you want, make fun of Christians and conservatives all you want, but at the end of the day, what SOMEBODY believes is RIGHT, and what SOMEBODY ELSE believes is wrong.

That's just the way it is.

randy said...

Ah...rev. Bill...the voice of reason. Thanks Bill. But I think you are beating a dead horse here. I completely agree with you though

Joe said...

And that, Rev. Bill, is kind of silly, because just because you believe something is the absolute truth, that does not mean it is so. Certainly the examples you point out support what you say. But let's use homosexuality. The bible is not clear. No, it is not. Just because you believe the sin of Sodom is homosexuality, even though the overwhelming evidence plus Jesus' words say it is not, does not make it true.

So why don't we err on the side of God's love and Jesus' embracing of all of us? Maybe there is an absolute truth in there somewhere. Like God is love. Love comes from God. Love between two men, therefore, comes from God. Absolutely.

Javi said...

Well said, Joe.

Furthermore, Rev. Bill, look at the examples you used: murder, theft, incest... all of which are things in which an innocent party is hurt and their rights and dignity are violated. Obviously, we are not talking about the same thing here. Building a life with someone, loving them and building a family should not be equated to those crimes you mentioned. Under any circumstance. Not even to argue a point that is without merit.

In the end, it comes down to this: 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' and Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.

Like it or not, the GLBT community are included in those neighbors that Jesus mentioned in the gospel. That is the one, certain, needs-no-interpretation rule that Jesus left in the Bible for all of us to follow.

barbie said...

Joe and Javi, yall have lost it. Of COURSE God is love. We are his creation. He loves everyone no matter what, but he will not continue to tolerate this lifestyle. God loved his creation when he DESTROYED IT with a flood. According to what you say, God would never do such a thing because he is LOVE. Well, sometimes loving someone means you have to correct them. Maybe Hank Erwin was right about the hurricane. How do we know.

But Joe, when you say the Bible is unclear about homosexuality, it is only unclear to those who preach that homosexuality is okay. My husband is an ordained Minister. He said their is overwhelming evidence in the Bible that homosexuality is wrong.

Love God and love each other are both things that we should do. But a man marrying another man? Uh, no.

Joe said...

Here is an ordained minister that you and your husband should listen to:

Be sure to read today's blog and tomorrows as well.

barbi said...

His beliefs are NOT the norm amongst biblical scholars. You know that Joe. There are FEW ministers that would agree with him (unless they are gay or have a gay congregation). Most legit biblical scholars would have a different view.

Joe said...

"Most legit biblical scholars would have a different view."

By "legit" I know what you mean. Biblical scholars who hold your views.

Let's see, of the major denominations of protestant churches...only the Southern Baptist is not recognizing the need for recognizing gay relationships to some degree. Episcopals bless, some Methodists and Presbyterians do.

But aside from that, marriage is a civil issue. No one is demanding that the church recognize it. We just want the legal rights and obligations granted by various levels of government. Keep the church out of the argument.

bhamdaniel said...

First, let me offer my most sincere condolences to all the friends, relatives and members of her district upon the death of Councilwoman, Ms. Miriam Witherspoon. As regards Rep. Jay Love, my parents, who are most decidedly conservative Republicans, and who attend church with him regularly, are NOT supporters of his or those of his ilk. As for ANYONE who, "speaks out," against human,civil rights for whatever reason, that person is NOT a friend of mine or of all humanity! GOD, save us all from the mean-spirited, anti-human rights folks for, they know NOT what they do [or say]."

rev. bill said...

Say what you want to, but the whole homosexual issue is KILLING our country. We are moving further and further away from God and are no longer being blessed.

Joe said...

Oh, no. Rev. Bill blames every problem in our country on the homosexuals. Never mind the greed on Wall Street. Never mind prople's lack of responsibility in managing their own debt. Never mind the fumbling of our county commissioners. It's all the homosexual's fault!!!

oh brother said...

As far as I know none of our county commissioners are gay (well I have suspicions about one) and they pretty much have been destroying our counties fiscal stability for years. So I blame the current mess in our county on my fellow straight people (well a few anyway).

And in regards to Katrina: If God sent a hurricane to destroy the wickedness of the Gulf Coast then why did he spare much of the central French Quarter and Bourbon Street while destroying churches, killing off or displacing entire families of church-goers? And why were the elderly found floating face door in sewage filled flood waters? Katrina affected a much broader area than just that "sin-filled" city of New Orleans but the "most sinful" areas got off pretty much unscathed.

Javi said...

Stop using religion to discriminate and oppress a minority group and you will stop moving farther and farther away from God.

Stop using a minority group as a scapegoat for what is wrong with this country and you will stop moving farther and farther away from God.

Stop blaming God for your socio-cultural-based intolerance and you will stop moving farther and farther away from God.

And by the way, God is a God of love and mercy, not one of fire and brimstone. And of course, we all are blessed by God everyday, still, to this very day.

randy said...

LOL....Javi - you don't have a clue my brother.

rev. bill said...

NONE of what you just wrote makes ANY sense Javi.
Put prayer back in schools, start respecting the sabbath day, allow prayer before football games, have businesses say MERRY CHRISTMAS rather than HAPPY HOLIDAYS, allow God to lead us like he led our founding fathers, and just MAYBE things will indeed get better.
I don't blame God for anything. I blame our "tollerant, Godless, sinful society" for the problems we are having.
God IS a God of love and mercy. But throughout the Bible you see that when society ignores God, HE takes care of business.

Joe said...

U. Javi,
Your words were brilliant. Thank you for your wisdom.

Bill and Randy, thanks for the comic relief. I'll be glad when you learn the truth.

With that said, no more comments on this thread. There is no reason to continue to go back and forth on this. Olin was right (from another thread). Let's just concentrate on the merits of treating everyone equal, and forget all this bigoted back and forth from the rightists.